# Language Discussion
**URL:** https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415
**Category:** Off-topic
**Created:** [March 2, 2018, 6:35pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415 "2018-03-02T18:35:34Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@Someone](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Someone)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 5:49pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/41 "2018-03-03T17:49:23Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/72):
>
> I’ve started being more nitpicky on here and I don’t like myself for it (especially since half the people aren’t native English speakers).
As I said already: You can correct me every time you like!
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/72):
>
> maybe I should start a private thread with just me in it,
You could start a new thread where you write about common errors. Like a blog about English grammar. 🙂 I would love to read that!
---
### Author:  [@tasse-tee](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/tasse-tee)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 5:54pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/42 "2018-03-03T17:54:22Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/72):
>
> maybe I should start a private thread with just me in it, where I can, er, get it out of my system
Kate’s Krusade - the Quest for Better Grammar 🏆
(and spelling)
---
### Author:  [@PiecesOfKate](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/PiecesOfKate)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 5:55pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/43 "2018-03-03T17:55:18Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/73):
>
> You could start a new thread where you write about common errors. Like a blog about English grammar. 🙂 I would love to read that!
Really? A blog about that could be fun… You might be the only reader, but still. A lot of examples come up in my job, so I shouldn’t be short of material. Hmmmmm.
---
### Author:  [@Someone](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Someone)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 6:00pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/44 "2018-03-03T18:00:48Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/75):
>
> Really? A blog about that could be fun…
Yes! Just add a little bit of humor or funny examples (feel free to take my mistakes and errors 🙂 ).
In Germany we have a very popular blog called “Zwiebelfisch” (the Wikipedia article is in English):
> **[Der Dativ ist dem Genitiv sein Tod](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Der_Dativ_ist_dem_Genitiv_sein_Tod)**
>
> Der Dativ ist dem Genitiv sein Tod (English: The Dative is the Death of the Genitive) is a series of books by Bastian Sick which deal in an entertaining manner with unappealing or clumsy use of the German language, as well as areas of contention in grammar, orthography, and punctuation.
> The books are collections of the author’s column 'Zwiebelfisch', which appeared from 2003 to 2012 in Spiegel Online. Since February 2005 it also appeared in print in Der Spiegel's monthly culture supplement. The ...
---
### Author:  [@PiecesOfKate](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/PiecesOfKate)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 6:02pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/45 "2018-03-03T18:02:34Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/74):
>
> Kate’s Krusade - the Quest for Better Grammar 🏆
>
> (and spelling)
I have a policy against intentional misspellings 😉 ooh, I could call it Miss Spelling!
Oh, wait
---
### Author:  [@milanfahrnholz](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/milanfahrnholz)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 6:31pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/46 "2018-03-03T18:31:20Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/70):
>
> > [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/69):
> >
> > pronounciation
>
> 🧐
What´s your problem? I was talking about the correct use of pronouns. “pronoun-ciation”…
---
### Author:  [@Guga](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Guga)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 6:33pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/47 "2018-03-03T18:33:39Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/73):
>
> As I said already: You can correct me every time you like!
Correct the wise, and you’ll make him wiser. Correct the fool, and you’ll make him your enemy. 🧐
---
### Author:  [@Someone](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Someone)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 7:09pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/48 "2018-03-03T19:09:36Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/79):
>
> Correct the fool, and you’ll make him your enemy. 🧐
---
### Author:  [@Nor\_Treblig](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Nor_Treblig)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 8:16pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/49 "2018-03-03T20:16:50Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/34):
>
> > [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/33):
> >
> > Yes, it’s Tasse Tee, as in “cup of tea”. The nickname is inspired by the foreign language tea in TWP.
>
> I was assuming it’s also a play on ‘tasty’.
_It’s pronounced tas-ty!_
Just picture him like that:
[ ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0mU3393PGk&t=8)
---
### Author:  [@milanfahrnholz](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/milanfahrnholz)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 8:18pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/50 "2018-03-03T20:18:28Z")
Oh look it´s David Warner! Better know as “that british actor who is in everything”.
---
### Author:  [@Ignacio](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Ignacio)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 10:23pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/51 "2018-03-03T22:23:53Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/56):
>
> Yeah, you know. That´s a bit stupid. Because it completly ignores dialect (like Bavarian) where that isn´t considered wrong.
I didn’t know that. I always thought dialects only changed certain words and pronunciation, but not the grammar!
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/56):
>
> Something we also do more than other germans is adding the article before saying peoples names and I actually feel weird not doing that when I speak german.
Ja ja, der Milan.
Adding an article before saying peoples names in Spanish is not correct and usually associated to ignorants.
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/55):
>
> Hey - the best way to learn German is to play adventure games in German!
Hm. Never thought about that. I should give it a try. Thanks also to @Someone and @LogicDeLuxe for their recommendations.
---
### Author:  [@milanfahrnholz](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/milanfahrnholz)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 10:34pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/52 "2018-03-03T22:34:13Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/85):
>
> I didn’t know that. I always thought dialects only changed certain words and pronunciation, but not the grammar!
It´s true though!
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/85):
>
> Ja ja, der Milan.
Most common way people greet me!
---
### Author:  [@Ema](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Ema)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 11:01pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/53 "2018-03-03T23:01:33Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/85):
>
> I didn’t know that. I always thought dialects only changed certain words and pronunciation, but not the grammar!
Italian dialects can be very different in grammar. Northern dialects have a grammar which takes a lot from french or other central Europe languages. Friulan takes a lot from slovenian.
Not to mention the dialects from Valdaosta and from Alto Adige which are actually, in turn, a French and German dialect.
Some southern regions take something from spanish or even arabian. Sardinian language… well, its a whole different language 😊
> [@](#):
>
> Ja ja, der Milan.
> Adding an article before saying peoples names in Spanish is not correct and usually associated to ignorants.
Adding an article before saying peoples names in Italian is not correct and usually associated to Milanese people 😄
---
### Author:  [@milanfahrnholz](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/milanfahrnholz)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 11:04pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/54 "2018-03-03T23:04:50Z")
---
### Author:  [@Ema](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Ema)
#### Post date: [March 3, 2018, 11:37pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/55 "2018-03-03T23:37:12Z")
Time for a boring and useless OT.
While the article before a given name is considered in italian an error, it is allowed to use it before a surname.
It is particularly true whe referring to the members of a family, just like in english:
“the greens” -\> “i verdi”
The difference is that in english the surname can change from singular (“Green”) to plural (“Greens”) when referring to more than one person. In italian you can’t change this: the colour green is translated into “verde”, which plural is “verdi”. “Verde” and “Verdi” are considered two different family names in italian, and you’ll keep them unchanged when referring to one or more people.
Sig. Verde -\> Mr. Verde
Sig. Verdi -\> Mr. Verdi
I Verde -\> The Verdes
I Verdi -\> The Verdis
The article before the surname when referring to one single person is quite uncommon nowadays and is used only in formal documents or when referring to important and distinguished personalities: “il Manzoni”, “il Petrarca”.
It has been a common habit until some years ago to mantain the article before women’s surnames as like when talking about plural people. that’s because articles in italian are not only number-secific but also gender-specific: since surnames are unchangeable in gender and number, using the correct article before a surname is a smart and easy way to understand if you’re talking about a man, a woman, or a whole family:
“Il Rossi” or simply “Rossi” -\> a man
"La Rossi" -\> a woman
"I Rossi" -\> a Family
Anyway, some people nowadays started considering this habit as “politically uncorrect”, so now a lot of people refers also to women omitting the article before the surname.
---
### Author:  [@Nor\_Treblig](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Nor_Treblig)
#### Post date: [March 4, 2018, 12:09am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/57 "2018-03-04T00:09:42Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/91):
>
> “Il Rossi” or simply “Rossi” → a man
> “La Rossi” → a woman
> “I Rossi” → a Family
Does it work the same with numbers?
Il 46, La 46, I 46?
---
### Author:  [@Someone](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Someone)
#### Post date: [March 4, 2018, 12:15am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/58 "2018-03-04T00:15:53Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/88):
>
> > [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/85):
> >
> > I didn’t know that. I always thought dialects only changed certain words and pronunciation, but not the grammar!
>
> It´s true though!
I can confirm this for several other German dialects too. 🙂
(We are now extremely off-topic. Maybe @Calypso can/should put/move all posts about the language stuff in a new thread?)
---
### Author:  [@Guga](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Guga)
#### Post date: [March 4, 2018, 2:09pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/59 "2018-03-04T14:09:38Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/89):
>
> Adding an article before saying peoples names in Italian is not correct and usually associated to Milanese people
That’s why I was so scared when I heard my daughter saying it 😛 I told it to my sister and parents and they were like “NOOOO she’s a northerner now!”
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/56):
>
> Something we also do more than other germans is adding the article before saying peoples names and I actually feel weird not doing that when I speak german.
You know, it happens is Zurich too. Not that much, but still at least half of the time I had colleagues doing that.
---
### Author:  [@Frenzie](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Frenzie)
#### Post date: [March 4, 2018, 2:28pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/60 "2018-03-04T14:28:19Z")
Just read some English books from the 19th century instead. 😉 They’re all one-and-twenty this, two-and-thirty that.
---
### Author:  [@Someone](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Someone)
#### Post date: [March 4, 2018, 3:20pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415/61 "2018-03-04T15:20:14Z")
> [@To beep or not to beep - that is the question](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/to-beep-or-not-to-beep-that-is-the-question/2407/100):
>
> but still at least half of the time I had colleagues doing that.
Like “Der Fahrnholz Milan!”?
[Previous page](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415.md?page=2)
[Next page](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/language-discussion/2415.md?page=4)