# TWP on itch.io and Citizen of the Future **URL:** \ **Category:** Off-topic\ **Created:** [December 6, 2018, 3:23am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388 "2018-12-06T03:23:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Nor\_Treblig](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/nor_treblig/32/216_2.png) [@Nor\_Treblig](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Nor_Treblig)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2018, 3:23am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/1 "2018-12-06T03:23:15Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/266): > > Btw. why isn’t TWP available on itch? Because it would have been once another type of build to manage. By providing builds to GOG they at least don’t have to make installers for different operating systems by themselves. Btw. there is also no DRM-free version on Humble, you just get a Steam key. ---
**Author:** ![ideal](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/ideal/32/9563_2.png) [@ideal](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/ideal)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2018, 3:38am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/2 "2018-12-06T03:38:48Z")
Why do you need to build installers? itch as well as the hbs (for other DRM free games) don’t use installers, they just use zips. ---
**Author:** ![Nor\_Treblig](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/nor_treblig/32/216_2.png) [@Nor\_Treblig](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Nor_Treblig)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2018, 10:38am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/3 "2018-12-06T10:38:28Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/268): > > Why do you need to build installers? Installers are needed to provide a convenient way to install prerequisites, automatically copy game files to your disk (plus handling permissions) and create shortcuts to executables so it can be easily found by your operating system and the user. If you don’t provide installers you have to provide instructions how to setup your game, how to install possible prerequisites (e.g. where to get them, how to install them) and you have to do this for every operating system you provide builds for. And then you have to support not just issues with your game but also when people having problems with manual installation. If there are problems with setup on GOG then GOG support will handle this. > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/268): > > itch as well as the hbs (for other DRM free games) don’t use installers, they just use zips. itch.io and Humble does not care if files are installers or ZIP files, they allow downloading arbitrary files from creators. Those can be containers like .zip, .dmg etc. which need to be manually extracted/mounted, or those can be executables/installers like .exe, .app. Depending on the content being sold it can be anything (.pdf, .mobi etc.). I have dozens of games from Humble providing .zip files and dozens providing .exe installers. ---
**Author:** ![ideal](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/ideal/32/9563_2.png) [@ideal](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/ideal)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2018, 10:48am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/4 "2018-12-06T10:48:38Z")
Let’s put it this way: I do not own a game on itch which doesn’t come as a zip file and doesn’t work out of the box (DD is still streaming though), once you unzipped it. The HBS also has a couple of DMGs. Installers add another level of complexity, where something can go wrong and unless you dig into the packages, you don’t know what’s going on. You need to enter your pass. They need to keep them up-to-date and repackage games … for most cases, it’s more work for getting the same done - kiss. I think it’s unfortunate that TWP isn’t available on itch and that the HBS only offers a Steam key. Dunno if this is due to the publishers but I never had a feeling that Ron Gilbert is a strong supporter of DRM free software, at least when it comes to his games. ---
**Author:** ![Nor\_Treblig](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/nor_treblig/32/216_2.png) [@Nor\_Treblig](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Nor_Treblig)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2018, 11:24am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/5 "2018-12-06T11:24:54Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/270): > > I do not own a game on itch which doesn’t come as a zip file Looking at my Humble Windows games about 50% have installers and about 50% ZIP files. I don’t have a lot of games on itch.io but most I have seen use ZIP files. Here is an example of a game [I’ve posted recently](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/the-adventure-games-on-sale-thread/2838/201) which uses an Windows installer: [Captain Disaster in: Death Has A Million Stomping Boots](https://captaind.itch.io/captain-disaster-in-death-has-a-million-stomping-boots) > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/270): > > kiss Of course developers try to have as few dependencies as possible but sometimes you have them. On Windows very common ones are versions of Visual C++ Redistributable, DirectX and .NET Framework. Looking at my Windows Steam games 30% need Visual C++, 45% DirectX, 8% .NET. > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/270): > > I think it’s unfortunate that TWP isn’t available on itch and that the HBS only offers a Steam key. Games on Humble which offer Steam keys only are rather useless. But not completely: IF I want a game which is only on Steam I rather pay Humble money instead of giving Steam any payment information. > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/270): > > due to the publishers They publish their (PC) games themselves. For a comment about itch.io see > [@How many verbs are perfect?](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/how-many-verbs-are-perfect/2383/58): > > [itch.io](http://itch.io) is a mess. TWP isn’t on there either. If you’re on [itch.io](http://itch.io), you need to make your own Windows installer (Steam/GOG do this for you). Not rocket science, but it’s a hurdle. And you have to set up your store and make a bunch of images in formats very different from Steam. Puting a game on a store is a pain in the ass. Plus, you probably have to do a different build if you’re doing anything with Steam APIs (achievements). Now you’re managing 2 builds. And you have a new place to monitor… He considered putting it on there later. Apparently it didn’t happen. ---
**Author:** ![ideal](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/ideal/32/9563_2.png) [@ideal](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/ideal)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2018, 12:17pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/6 "2018-12-06T12:17:55Z")
I agree about the payment but the real question is have you bought any Steam games this way? Jesus, it all sounds doable and who needs Steam achievements anyway?! How about Epic’s store then? Will evil sized images stop him, again? (I’ll have a look at your entry.) ---
**Author:** ![ideal](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/ideal/32/9563_2.png) [@ideal](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/ideal)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2018, 3:53pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/7 "2018-12-06T15:53:12Z")
Dude, this is Windows only. ---
**Author:** ![Nor\_Treblig](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/nor_treblig/32/216_2.png) [@Nor\_Treblig](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Nor_Treblig)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2018, 6:37pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/8 "2018-12-06T18:37:00Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/272): > > I agree about the payment but the real question is have you bought any Steam games this way? I haven’t bought anything from Steam directly for a long time. I think [The Cave](https://store.steampowered.com/app/221810/The_Cave/) (2013) was the last game. I try to avoid Steam as much as possible. Since then I remember buying Steam only games like [Costume Quest 2](https://www.humblebundle.com/store/costume-quest-2), [King’s Quest](https://www.humblebundle.com/store/kings-quest-the-complete-collection) ([yes, it’s called like that](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/annoying-movie-game-titles/3362/7)) and [Overcooked](https://www.humblebundle.com/store/overcooked) via Humble (Bundles). > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/273): > > Dude, this is Windows only. Captain Disaster? Yes, native is Windows only. Btw. it uses AGS so there is a high chance it runs using wine. ---
**Author:** ![ideal](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/ideal/32/9563_2.png) [@ideal](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/ideal)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2018, 1:14am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/9 "2018-12-07T01:14:37Z")
The Cave, another game from Ron (nick: analyzer) which isn’t available on a DRM free platform, except the AppStore and for Android (obviously the best platform for such a puzzle platformer). I knew your opinion about Steam and DRM already, I was just curious if you still hold up to your standards. What’s your opinion about the episodic King’s Quest? No, I don’t want to use Wine, you only have a bad experience, draining the battery for mostly low res adventures. What’s up with the AGS macOS port? Did Wadjet Eye port AGS for Unavowed on their own? As far as I can remember, it was at least differently setup (which sadly had no positive influenceon the game). Looking at the latest adventures, Unity + Adventure Creator seems to be a popular option. ---
**Author:** ![ideal](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/ideal/32/9563_2.png) [@ideal](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/ideal)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2018, 2:35pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/10 "2018-12-07T14:35:54Z")
Btw. I was bored and made a DMG as well as an installer for macOS, took about 10 minutes, also with more reasonable Prefs.json default settings. If I remember this correctly, there existed a nice tiny tool for Windows. ---
**Author:** ![Frenzie](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/frenzie/32/4416_2.png) [@Frenzie](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Frenzie)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2018, 5:26pm UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/11 "2018-12-07T17:26:24Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/259): > > I also like [Prince of Persia](https://www.mobygames.com/game/prince-of-persia) I liked it, but I never got terribly far. Especially with that time limit! 😃 (Also I didn’t have it at home.) > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/262): > > I, for instance, don’t know anyone who has completed any NFL, NBA, FIFA sort of game (assuming they have some sort of career mode). I finished one or two FIFAs. We had a tournament thing where you lead your team through a championship and then you switch out whether you play your team or the opponents with your friends. Or you both play on the same team, but that’s a bit weirder to control. > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/266): > > Btw. why isn’t TWP available on itch? Because it’s now available on a brand new platform the name of which I forgot. 😛 > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/269): > > Installers are needed to provide a convenient way to install prerequisites, automatically copy game files to your disk (plus handling permissions) and create shortcuts to executables so it can be easily found by your operating system and the user. Meh, the GOG installers are kind of a pain to extract because you need this innoextract program. 🙂 > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/271): > > Games on Humble which offer Steam keys only are rather useless. But not completely: IF I want a game which is only on Steam I rather pay Humble money instead of giving Steam any payment information. I tend to just go with the cheapest Steam key. Which might very well be Humble. > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/275): > > No, I don’t want to use Wine, you only have a bad experience, draining the battery for mostly low res adventures. Are we using the same Wine? 🙂 (Because my experience is very good, often better than native.) ---
**Author:** ![ideal](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/ideal/32/9563_2.png) [@ideal](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/ideal)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2018, 2:17am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/12 "2018-12-08T02:17:20Z")
I don’t know, I used to drink nice Barolos but if we’re talking about the compatibility layer, then I’ve made different experiences. Will be interesting to see, how their Vulkan wrapper will work out. ---
**Author:** ![Nor\_Treblig](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/nor_treblig/32/216_2.png) [@Nor\_Treblig](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Nor_Treblig)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 3:49am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/13 "2018-12-12T03:49:09Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/277): > > > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/259): > > > > I also like [Prince of Persia](https://www.mobygames.com/game/prince-of-persia) > > I liked it, but I never got terribly far. Especially with that time limit! 😃 At least they were upfront that there is a time limit. i.e. you know there is no hour-long grinding necessary to win this game which is a nice information. Larry 1 on the other hand… sneaky bastards! > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/277): > > > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/266): > > > > Btw. why isn’t TWP available on itch? > > Because it’s now available on a brand new platform the name of which I forgot. 😛 It’s called Kartridge. Nice name but it basically looks very much like a Steam clone. Their website is extensively animated (have fun browsing via remote session). You need a desktop app (Win/Mac). They aren’t mentioning DRM(-free) anywhere, which according to my interpretation means: Yes, lots of DRM. > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/277): > > Meh, the GOG installers are kind of a pain to extract because you need this innoextract program. 🙂 Is there a problem with running the installers themselves? Maybe they could make them Wine-compatible? > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/275): > > The Cave, another game from Ron (nick: analyzer) which isn’t available on a DRM free platform Huh? Ron released all of the games under his control DRM-free. Which are: TWP. Are you complaining about him while being employed as programmer or game designer etc. being responsible what publishers demand? Double Fine released all of their games they had control of DRM-free ([GOG](https://www.gog.com/games?devpub=double_fine_productions&page=1&sort=title), [itch.io](https://doublefine.itch.io/)). The Cave was originally published by SEGA! It seems like Double Fine now have the rights back, so just send them a big load of money and they will happily pull the sources out of their (hopefully) existing archives and release the game on all other distribution platforms we care about. ---
**Author:** ![Frenzie](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/frenzie/32/4416_2.png) [@Frenzie](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Frenzie)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 7:27am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/14 "2018-12-12T07:27:14Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/279): > > It’s called Kartridge. Right! > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/279): > > Is there a problem with running the installers themselves? Maybe they could make them Wine-compatible? The installers are Wine compatible, but often you just want the game data. - Win 3 / Win 9x software → probably Wine (= using the GOG installer) - DOSBox (/Win3) / ScummVM / id Tech / other native engine available → probably just game data, but you can’t just right click and open it in the archive manager of your choice, making this somewhat specialized knowledge that you can’t easily stumble upon by experimenting with your computer 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ideal](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/ideal/32/9563_2.png) [@ideal](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/ideal)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 7:56am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/15 "2018-12-12T07:56:33Z")
The paltfrom sounds like a spelling error. Cartridge would have been a good name but not Kartridge. It looks rather shabby, they still offer Flash games and you need a shitty desktop app. I definitely favor [itch.io](http://itch.io) which is DRM free (which might be a reason why Ron Gilbert isn’t there.) See! There is no DRM free version of ‘The Cave’. Jesus, you take everything so serious. If DF owns the rights now, they could release it on [itch.io](http://itch.io). Let me take a look, their/our adventure is available there and, oh, many ‘The Cave’ games as well, just not the ‘The Cave’. I would rebuy a working CQ2 from [itch.io](http://itch.io) too. ---
**Author:** ![Frenzie](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/frenzie/32/4416_2.png) [@Frenzie](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Frenzie)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 9:16am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/16 "2018-12-12T09:16:11Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/281): > > I definitely favor [itch.io](http://itch.io) which is DRM free (which might be a reason why Ron Gilbert isn’t there.) All of these are DRM-free, so I’m not quite following the allegation. ![Screenshot_2018-12-12_10-14-23](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/uploads/thimbleweedpark/original/2X/a/af34c531bee68f6946c4f7f2cfdb71648c16816a.png) ![Screenshot_2018-12-12_10-14-42](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/uploads/thimbleweedpark/original/2X/a/a564ea6db7f73639f2e5627c4959d07a34d48d50.png) ![Screenshot_2018-12-12_10-15-03](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/uploads/thimbleweedpark/original/2X/e/ee1cae5c24e01e8d488d0751cae124cb1a4df1d6.png) ---
**Author:** ![ideal](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/ideal/32/9563_2.png) [@ideal](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/ideal)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 9:59am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/17 "2018-12-12T09:59:47Z")
What are you doing? You seem to be on the verge starting to post naked pictures of you. Look, I know about GOG and this is fine (except the installing thing) but wouldn’t it be nice to have a game like TWP on other platforms as well? And if so, would you prefer alternatives to Steam or DRM free platforms? Which ones would you choose then? Common and more friendly platforms or weird, restrictive ones? I (as someone who’s interested in DRM free games) think, that it would be nice a) to have TWP on [itch.io](http://itch.io) and b) to offer this option on the Humble Store as well because this feels nicer than just offering a Steam key. You bought TWP on a sale? … It’s kind of sad that Ransome Unbeeped was the only DLC (and similar to the analytics the default settings are just wrong). ---
**Author:** ![Frenzie](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/frenzie/32/4416_2.png) [@Frenzie](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Frenzie)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 10:38am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/18 "2018-12-12T10:38:09Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/283): > > Look, I know about GOG and this is fine No, it’s not. That means you knowingly post drivel. ---
**Author:** ![milanfahrnholz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cab0a1/32.png) [@milanfahrnholz](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/milanfahrnholz)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 11:13am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/19 "2018-12-12T11:13:11Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/281): > > The **paltfrom** sounds like a spelling error. 🤭 ---
**Author:** ![Nor\_Treblig](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forums.thimbleweedpark.com/nor_treblig/32/216_2.png) [@Nor\_Treblig](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/u/Nor_Treblig)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 11:27am UTC](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388/20 "2018-12-12T11:27:46Z")
> [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/281): > > See! There is no DRM free version of ‘The Cave’. […] If DF owns the rights now, they could release it on itch.io. You don’t seem to understand that games don’t release by themselves, as TTG games don’t fix and patches by themselves. There need to be work done to do so. People need to do this which first has to be approved. We are talking about a nearly 6 year old game. Those don’t sell like hot cakes after that time you must know. In fact DF exactly knows how much their games sell and if they aren’t selling dozens on Steam every week they will sell even a lot less on other PC platforms. So, did you already mail that pile of money to them? > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/281): > > The paltfrom sounds like a spelling error. 🤦‍♂️ (btw. to be precise: No. It sounds exactly the same.) > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/281): > > you need a shitty desktop app I don’t know if their app is shitty. The requirement to need one is though. > [@Just released adventure games](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/just-released-adventure-games/1428/281): > > I definitely favor itch.io which is DRM free. It’s not. Well OK, it is. But the content you can get/buy on itch().io can contain anything the creator likes, including DRM. [Next page](https://forums.thimbleweedpark.com/t/twp-on-itch-io-and-citizen-of-the-future/3388.md?page=2)