The official language thread

[Gffp]

@PiecesOfKate

Dude… you need to wash more But seriously, that looks lovely. I love swimming in wild places like that (though if you’re friend was cold, I’m betting I would be). Is that tiny Gffp in the photo?

You know, I prefer to take a shower
(Damn, that’s because in Italian we use the same expression for taking a bath and having a dip!)
Yeah, that’s a tiny me.

@ZakPhoenixMcKracken

But if you meet @gffp I wish a good selfie of you two with a wonderful background!

Yes, the only problem is… that I’m going to Abruzzo this friday morning for the week-end (hiking in national parks and a bit of swimming in adriatic sea). Then I guess the only forumer I’ll be able to take selfies with is… @seguso ! Sorry Kate but, at least, we’ll continue to keep our face secret !

[milanfahrnholz]

@Gffp

Sorry Kate but, at least, we’ll continue to keep our face secret !

Oh my gaaaaaaawd what´s wrong with your face?

[Gffp]

@milanfahrnholz

Oh my gaaaaaaawd what´s wrong with your face?

Nothing, I like @yrface, he’s a great guy!

[PiecesOfKate]

@Gffp

(Damn, that’s because in Italian we use the same expression for taking a bath and having a dip!)

I thought as much, but the joke was too inviting

@Gffp

Yeah, that’s a tiny me.

@Gffp

Then I guess the only forumer I’ll be able to take selfies with is… @seguso ! Sorry Kate but, at least, we’ll continue to keep our face secret !

No worries, I was actually wondering where Zak was in the conversation, not area of Italy. But good to know where you’re all going to be this weekend

@milanfahrnholz

Oh my gaaaaaaawd what´s wrong with your face?

Owwww I want to watch that but I’m at work. Hold that thought for another five hours!

[Sushi]

@Frenzie

@Sushi

Idem dito in Dutch: “dat is een ander paar mouwen”

That’s French, not Dutch. (Belgian-Dutch loan from French.) Dutch is: “dat is andere koek.”

That’s because I am Belgian. We never say “andere koek”. (We eat them)
If I have to start writing “in Flemish, we say…”, then you should write “In Hollandish, we say”.
Or prefix Dutch each time… pfff
Same with French by the way.
Or English (UK/US)…
Or probably as in any other language…

And no, that’s not French. “Ça c’est une autre pair de manches”, now THAT is French.

[yrface]

@Gffp

Nothing, I like @yrface, he’s a great guy!

Thank you, kind sir.

[Frenzie]

@Sushi

If I have to start writing “in Flemish, we say…”, then you should write “In Hollandish, we say”.

I’m in favor of including many more Belgian words and phrases as part of the Standard Language than most Belgians are willing to entertain, actually. But there’s a difference between Standard Dutch in its various manifestations and things that are not.

Mea culpa, however, because it looks like I underestimated public opinion on this one and the expression is indeed considered Standard Dutch: https://www.taaltelefoon.be/standaardtaal-verschillen-tussen-belgië-en-nederland

They include a few examples of words that I hope will be considered Standard Dutch in a decade or so.

Een negatief aanvaardbaarheidsoordeel is de reden waarom veel tussentaalwoorden niet als standaardtaal in België worden beschouwd. Veel standaardtaalsprekers hebben bijvoorbeeld bezwaar tegen het veelvoorkomende gebruik van noemen als heten wordt bedoeld (Hoe noemt ze nu weer?). Daarom wordt dat gebruik niet als standaardtaal beschouwd: een eindredacteur zal in een krantenartikel de Amerikaanse president noemt Obama zonder twijfel corrigeren. Andere voorbeelden van woorden waarover een negatief aanvaardbaarheidsoordeel wordt geveld, zijn frigo (voor ‘koelkast’), mazout (voor ‘stookolie’), valling (voor ‘verkoudheid’) en camion (voor ‘vrachtwagen’).

[Guga]

Do Belgians have words that don’t make sense for a Dutch?

This is something that always fascinated me about languages that spread across more than one country. It happens in Swiss Italian too, but most notably in Swiss German. I mean, “standard” German spoken in Switzerland, not the Swiss German language which is different.

The worst part is learning to speak in that country and then going to Germany and finding out people there don’t know what a Lavabo is.

“Hotel reception? Hi, I’m calling because our lavabo is clogged”
“Your what?”
“Our lavabo.”
“I’m sorry, I don’t know what that is.”
“A… lavabo. That thing that collects water when you wash your hands.”
“You mean a sink?”
“I suppose yes.” (actually happened to us on vacation)

[seguso]

@Gffp

Yes, the only problem is… that I’m going to Abruzzo this friday morning for the week-end (hiking in national parks and a bit of swimming in adriatic sea). Then I guess the only forumer I’ll be able to take selfies with is… @seguso

I live on the seaside but I promise to wave a hand looking at the mountains at exactly 6.45.

(but seriously, if you are in Pescara saturday or sunday afternoon we can drink something :))

[seguso]

@Guga

Hotel reception? Hi, I’m calling because our lavabo is clogged”

But more importantly, who in Italy calls it “lavabo”? Fashion designers maybe? it’s called “lavandino” man.

[Gffp]

I’ve been in Pescara a couple of times, lovely city! We’ve planned to be in Vasto, and then move to Pescasseroli and near places. We have only two (full) days, but saturday I could come to Pescara. A friend of us comes from Switzerland, and if we have to take him back to main railway station in Pescara, it could be good for saturday. I’ll let you know if we consider this option. Thanks anyway!

[seguso]

ok! tell me in advance so I can get some nose and glasses

[Ema]

@Frenzie

@Ema

freezed

Frozen.

Yeah, sure
But actually I used that form purposely… I’ve met it more than once, always in a figurative meaning, as “blocked”… So I assumed it was legit in that meaning. Probably I’ve just recycled a mistake, but, what do brits and americans think about that? Is it common as a mistake?
@yrface? @PiecesOfKate? @tasse-tee?

[PiecesOfKate]

@Ema

@Frenzie

@Ema

freezed

Frozen.

Yeah, sure
But actually I used that form purposely… I’ve met i more than once, always in a figurative meaning, as “blocked”… So I assumed it was legit in that meaning. Probably I’ve just recycled a mistake, but, what do brits and americans think about that? Is it common as a mistake?
@yrface? @PiecesOfKate? @tasse-tee?

I’ve seen it used sometimes, but it’s not really considered correct. ‘Frozen’ is correct for the sentence you’ve used it in above - though we’d perhaps say ‘I froze up’ or ‘I was frozen stiff’ to make it clear we’re being figurative (otherwise people might just think you’re really cold ).

[tasse-tee]

@PiecesOfKate

I’ve seen it used sometimes, but it’s not really considered correct.

I may have heard it occasionally, but on the whole it doesn’t sound natural to me.

[Guga]

@seguso

who in Italy calls it “lavabo”

In fact, I was referring to Swiss German and the stress is on the first A, it’s LA-va-bo, not la-VA-bo as you would say in Italian

[Frenzie]

@Guga

The worst part is learning to speak in that country and then going to Germany and finding out people there don’t know what a Lavabo is.

That’s just minor noise. It only becomes bad if someone makes it so. Like that waiter in Nürnberg who insisted on addressing me in English because I didn’t know one or two south German words. >_< I mean sheesh, I merely asked for clarification as to whether Tafelwasser was flat or sparking like Sprudelwasser.

Luckily it was a one time only occurrence. He’d made up his mind that I couldn’t speak German, because it’s such a basic word I guess, and that was that.

Also, also, also, just saying “it’s table water” doesn’t clarify a freaking thing because that’s not even English! Tafelwasser translates literally as table water, who would’ve ever thought.

You actually already mentioned an example of a Belgian-Dutch word that most speakers of Netherlandic Dutch may not know. Lavabo — stress on the first syllable of course, since we’re not Italians over here — is Brabantic and possibly Belgian-Dutch for wastafel/wasbak.

Insofar as usage is delineated by geographical borders it’s really more provincial borders than national borders. It’s only some administrative terms that are explicitly national.

There’s also this odd thing where Belgians often think synonyms of words that are more usual in the Netherlands are more formal and vice versa.

@Ema

But actually I used that form purposely… I’ve met it more than once, always in a figurative meaning, as “blocked”… So I assumed it was legit in that meaning. Probably I’ve just recycled a mistake, but, what do brits and americans think about that? Is it common as a mistake?

There might be some dialects where that’s the regular form (link) but it’s definitely not standard.

[Sushi]

@Frenzie

and possibly Belgian-Dutch for wastafel/wasbak.

Except we usually call the lavabo “pompbak”, lol

@Guga

Do Belgians have words that don’t make sense for a Dutch?

Oh, yes. Lots of them (and vice versa- but slightly less I guess). Now most of them, are clear from the context, they just sound a bit awkward to the other party, especially when the same word is used for something else in the other country.
Pretty = “schoon” (B) = “mooi” (NL) vs clean = “schoon” (NL) = “proper” (B). To tidy = “opschonen” (NL) = “uitkuisen” (B).

Or “lopen” (B) = to run (fast) = “rennen” (NL)
Vs “lopen” (NL)= to walk = “stappen /te voet gaan” (B)

Another famous difference is the use of “you” versus “thee/thou”. In NL people tend to tutoyer each other, while in B people tend to vousvoyer each other (regardless of how well you know each other).
I love you = “ik hou van jou/je” (NL) = “ik hou van u” (B). That last one sounds very strange to most NL-Dutch people, to first express something as intimately close as love and then this formal “u”, which NL-Dutch only use for very polite situations.
In B-Dutch we also use “ge/gij” more often than “je/jij”. In NL-Dutch “ge/gij” is used mainly in religious and other archaic contexts. Like “thee/thy/thou” in English.
“You are” = “je bent” (NL) = “ge zijt” (B)

[Frenzie]

@Sushi

Except we usually call the lavabo “pompbak”, lol

The way I’ve picked it up here in Antwerp a pompbak is a gootsteen (~kitchen sink) and a lavabo is a wastafel/wasbak (~bathroom sink). But in any case I doubt I’d know the rather bizarre sounding and hard to remember word lavabo if it weren’t semi-regularly used in my presence, and I don’t just mean in ads or by people you’re seeking to rent from. I mean people saying, e.g., “waar is de lavabo” and “er is geen lavabo in dit lokaal.” (Let ook goed op de kleine details; is er een lavabo aanwezig?)

What do you mean by “we”?

[Sushi]

@Frenzie

What do you mean by “we”?

We, Flemish/Belgians, of course

You’re right about the nuance between a lavabo a pompbak (although it may not be fully accurate to call a lavabo a pompbak, it isn’t frowned upon - same like calling any pen nen bic), especially in case of a sink used to fill/empty buckets. It looks like a big lavabo, but it is a “gootsteen” (disgusting word, means literally “gully stone”, I rather do the dishes in a pompbak, literally “pump basin”)

@Frenzie

the rather bizarre sounding and hard to remember word lavabo

A lavabo is for lavare washing (hands) only. Lavabo even literally translates to I will wash

@Frenzie

"waar is de lavabo” and “er is geen lavabo in dit lokaal.” (Let ook goed op de kleine details; is er een lavabo aanwezig?)

Uw autocorrect heeft dat al verbeterd, precies. Excuseer, blijkbaar Ja, in 't Vlaams (of Antwerps) zijn voorwerpen ook (al dan niet) aanwezig. Maar niet afwezig. Ge kunt in een hotel gaan reclameren (uw beklag doen) dat de beloofde kluis niet aanwezig is. Afwezig zou willen zeggen dat ze pootjes gekregen heeft en efkes (even) een toereke is gaan doen (blokje om)